Re: Parting tool recommendations

Ian wrote:

> I have to make a quantity of thickish washers from 30mm SS barstock, upto
> now I have been using an Eclipse HSS blade (about 1.5x8mm) holder but
> remember reading posts about part off tooling that uses carbide inserts.

Be aware, that you need a rigid lathe for the carbide part off tools.
Seems that you don't need a specific manufacturer. But most recommend
inserts of the SP.. type.

I have one, but I'm not fully convinced. Often enough, I prefer the HSS
blades. But for 30mm of SS, I'd take the carbide.

Nick

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 09:16:20 +0200, Nick Mueller <muellernick@gmx.de>
wrote:

>Ian wrote:
>
>> I have to make a quantity of thickish washers from 30mm SS barstock, upto
>> now I have been using an Eclipse HSS blade (about 1.5x8mm) holder but
>> remember reading posts about part off tooling that uses carbide inserts.
>
>Be aware, that you need a rigid lathe for the carbide part off tools.
>Seems that you don't need a specific manufacturer. But most recommend
>inserts of the SP.. type.
>
>I have one, but I'm not fully convinced. Often enough, I prefer the HSS
>blades. But for 30mm of SS, I'd take the carbide.
>
>Nick

How rigid is rigid though Nick?

I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for
everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last
year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to.
http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html

Makes parting an absolute breeze.

To be honest I use carbide turning tools almost exclusively on the
Myford, except for screwcutting, and one toolholder with a sandvik
coromant DCMT insert is practically a permanent fixture on the
toolpost.

Mind you I'm a lazy bugger too<g>.
I hardly ever alter the spindle speed from the Myford top-end of
640rpm, and cut pretty much everything from 4" diameter mild steel to
1mm silver steel on this speed, all with the dcmt insert, just
altering feed and depth of cut.

Peter

Peter Neill wrote:

> How rigid is rigid though Nick?

How rigid is a Myford? I don't know, but I think she isn't as bad as the
small Chinese cheapies.

> I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for
> everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last
> year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to.
> http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html

Yep, this type of inserts.
And no, below say 10mm I prefer the HSS. The carbide has higher cutting
forces and would bend something delicate (say a 2mm round) more than cut
it.

> Makes parting an absolute breeze.

Full ACK for something over 20mm or hard to cut like SS.
Parting off 40mm with HSS is an adventure, with carbide, it is a snap.

As HSS, I'm using the Komet part off blades. If you stone a small radius on
the right edge, they cut really nice. But, they have to be better aligned
than the carbide part off tools.

Nick

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 10:20:43 +0200, Nick Mueller <muellernick@gmx.de>
wrote:

<snipped a bit>
>Yep, this type of inserts.
>And no, below say 10mm I prefer the HSS. The carbide has higher cutting
>forces and would bend something delicate (say a 2mm round) more than cut
>it.

>Nick

I can completely agree with that, carbide does require you to be a bit
more brutal with the infeed, and would probably bend the smaller
stuff.

Again <lazy bugger mode>, I just use the hacksaw for the really small
stuff, and the bandsaw for the really big stuff.

Peter

"Peter Neill" <panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for
> everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last
> year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to.
> http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html
>
> Makes parting an absolute breeze.
>
Thanks for the really useful replies

It was the Q-cut tool I had in the back of my mind but had forgotten its
actual name.

My only concern would be the 2,5mm width of cut, I am used to 1.6mm which
the Boxford copes easily with, it also reduces wastage. Another advantage of
the loose HSS blade type is that only the minimum length of bit need to be
projecting which helps rigidity, I have also parted in to about 50mm depth
on 150mm diameter Delrin by extending the bit in stages.

Is the Q-cut an adaptation of another manufactures double ended holder I
wonder? if so I might buy one from J&L, make two, and see if anyone wants to
go 'halves'.

Ian in Cheshire

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 13:22:07 +0100, "Ian" <elanman99@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>"Peter Neill" <panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>>
>> I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for
>> everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last
>> year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to.
>> http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html
>>
>> Makes parting an absolute breeze.
>>
>Thanks for the really useful replies
>
>It was the Q-cut tool I had in the back of my mind but had forgotten its
>actual name.
>
>My only concern would be the 2,5mm width of cut, I am used to 1.6mm which
>the Boxford copes easily with, it also reduces wastage. Another advantage of
>the loose HSS blade type is that only the minimum length of bit need to be
>projecting which helps rigidity, I have also parted in to about 50mm depth
>on 150mm diameter Delrin by extending the bit in stages.
>
>Is the Q-cut an adaptation of another manufactures double ended holder I
>wonder? if so I might buy one from J&L, make two, and see if anyone wants to
>go 'halves'.
>
>Ian in Cheshire
>

Ian if you can wait until the Bristol show next month then visit Jenny
at JB Cutting tools.
She usually has different sorts on the stall at good prices.
I bought a double ended on off her for about £30 and the inserts are
also double sided and cheaper than the single sided ones like
Greenwood sells.
This is a 1.6mm wide blade and it cuts great.

Only problem with mine was the blade is tall, no problem to my lathes
but for a small lathe you would have to chop it in half then reduce
the height but the tip cost would more than pay for the hassle of
doing that.

Ian wrote:

> Is the Q-cut an adaptation of another manufactures double ended holder I
> wonder? if so I might buy one from J&L, make two, and see if anyone wants
> to go 'halves'.

It looks like.
You get the double ended holders for ... oops! ... 60.- EUR. Then build your
own clamp, because these cost above 130.- EUR. Prices for non-Chinese
quality.
BTDT:
<http://www.peters-cnc-ecke.de/forumupload/uploadFiles/16348_125_schwert1.jpg>
<http://www.peters-cnc-ecke.de/forumupload/uploadFiles/16348_125_schwert4.jpg>
<http://www.peters-cnc-ecke.de/forumupload/uploadFiles/16348_125_schwert2.jpg>
<http://www.peters-cnc-ecke.de/forumupload/uploadFiles/16348_112571877787_schwert5.jpg>

Hope you can reach the pictures.

The smallest inserts are 2.2mm or you bite the SECO price-tag and you get
1.4mm. SECO inserts are expensive (starting at 9.- EUR / pc), holders are
expensive starting at 75.- EUR, clamp costs "just" 200.- EUR. But the
holders are made out of HSS. If everything fails, you can regrind
them. ;-))

Nick

"John Stevenson" <john@stevenson-engineers.co.uk> wrote in message >

> Ian if you can wait until the Bristol show next month then visit Jenny
> at JB Cutting tools.

> She usually has different sorts on the stall at good prices.
> I bought a double ended on off her for about £30 and the inserts are
> also double sided and cheaper than the single sided ones like
> Greenwood sells.
> This is a 1.6mm wide blade and it cuts great.
>
> Only problem with mine was the blade is tall, no problem to my lathes
> but for a small lathe you would have to chop it in half then reduce
> the height but the tip cost would more than pay for the hassle of
> doing that.

John

I could wait for the Bristol Show but probably wont, due to impatience. I
would definitely prefer something narrower than 2.5mm.

Do you know how machinable are the blades that hold the tip.

Are the double ended tips a compromise over the single types I wonder?

Ian on the Cheshire Plain

Ian wrote:

> Are the double ended tips a compromise over the single types I wonder?

The other end will cut (or rub) too at deeper cuts.

Nick

"Nick Mueller" <muellernick@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:2941996.azxyPcSpYH@yadro.de...
> Ian wrote:
>
>> Are the double ended tips a compromise over the single types I wonder?
>
> The other end will cut (or rub) too at deeper cuts.
>
>
> Nick

I never thought of that Nick, but you are right.

HSS cutting tools rub fine but my experience with tips on SS is that the
cutting edge can break off if the job is rotating in the wrong direction.

Ian

In article <47m8a353i8k6favmp9icktmn177i94reku@4ax.com>, Peter Neill
<panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> writes
>On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 09:16:20 +0200, Nick Mueller <muellernick@gmx.de>
>wrote:
>
>>Ian wrote:
>>
>>> I have to make a quantity of thickish washers from 30mm SS barstock, upto
>>> now I have been using an Eclipse HSS blade (about 1.5x8mm) holder but
>>> remember reading posts about part off tooling that uses carbide inserts.
>>
>>Be aware, that you need a rigid lathe for the carbide part off tools.
>>Seems that you don't need a specific manufacturer. But most recommend
>>inserts of the SP.. type.
>>
>>I have one, but I'm not fully convinced. Often enough, I prefer the HSS
>>blades. But for 30mm of SS, I'd take the carbide.
>>
>>Nick
>
>
>How rigid is rigid though Nick?
>
>I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for
>everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last
>year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to.
>http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html
>
>Makes parting an absolute breeze.
>
>To be honest I use carbide turning tools almost exclusively on the
>Myford, except for screwcutting, and one toolholder with a sandvik
>coromant DCMT insert is practically a permanent fixture on the
>toolpost.
>
>Mind you I'm a lazy bugger too<g>.
>I hardly ever alter the spindle speed from the Myford top-end of
>640rpm, and cut pretty much everything from 4" diameter mild steel to
>1mm silver steel on this speed, all with the dcmt insert, just
>altering feed and depth of cut.
>
>Peter

I entirely agree with Peter - I have been using the Q-cut for a couple
of years on my S7, and you would have to shoot me to take it away.

Yesterday I was parting off some 30mm MS, and forgot to drop down from
615 to 200 rpm (as I would normally) but the Q-cut sliced through
without pausing for breath. I have even seen the Myford men
demonstrating parting off under PXF using one - something I can't
imagine doing with a conventional tool.

The only time I have gone back to conventional tools recently was to
part off some nylon bar, where I worked out that my narrow HS tool would
*just* get me 3 pieces instead of 2.

David
--
David Littlewood

David Littlewood wrote:

> I have even seen the Myford men
> demonstrating parting off under PXF using one - something I can't
> imagine doing with a conventional tool.

Does parting off of 35mm with a HSS (Komet blade 1.9mm) under power feed
qualify?

Nick

In article <5ep8a3185984rfo34jm40a9tmc1csd8por@4ax.com>, Peter Neill
<panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> writes
>On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 10:20:43 +0200, Nick Mueller <muellernick@gmx.de>
>wrote:
>
><snipped a bit>
>>Yep, this type of inserts.
>>And no, below say 10mm I prefer the HSS. The carbide has higher cutting
>>forces and would bend something delicate (say a 2mm round) more than cut
>>it.
>
>>Nick
>
>I can completely agree with that, carbide does require you to be a bit
>more brutal with the infeed, and would probably bend the smaller
>stuff.
>
>Again <lazy bugger mode>, I just use the hacksaw for the really small
>stuff, and the bandsaw for the really big stuff.
>
>Peter

Can't say I have had much problem parting off small sections with a
Q-Cut - just have to ensure the part line is close to the chuck. Or,
more likely, near the collet. I parted off several sections of 1/8
silver steel yesterday with no problems. I would be surprised if an HS
tool would have been easier.

In general (i.e. normal turning, not just parting) I feel the belief
that TC tools are unable to take fine cuts is a myth. I find they can
shave off a few tenths off FCMS without too much trouble, and tougher
stuff with maybe more care to use a sharp (new) tip.

David
--
David Littlewood

	#1
Nick Mueller	Re: Parting tool recommendations Ian wrote: > I have to make a quantity of thickish washers from 30mm SS barstock, upto > now I have been using an Eclipse HSS blade (about 1.5x8mm) holder but > remember reading posts about part off tooling that uses carbide inserts. Be aware, that you need a rigid lathe for the carbide part off tools. Seems that you don't need a specific manufacturer. But most recommend inserts of the SP.. type. I have one, but I'm not fully convinced. Often enough, I prefer the HSS blades. But for 30mm of SS, I'd take the carbide. Nick

	#2
Peter Neill	Re: Parting tool recommendations On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 09:16:20 +0200, Nick Mueller <muellernick@gmx.de> wrote: >Ian wrote: > >> I have to make a quantity of thickish washers from 30mm SS barstock, upto >> now I have been using an Eclipse HSS blade (about 1.5x8mm) holder but >> remember reading posts about part off tooling that uses carbide inserts. > >Be aware, that you need a rigid lathe for the carbide part off tools. >Seems that you don't need a specific manufacturer. But most recommend >inserts of the SP.. type. > >I have one, but I'm not fully convinced. Often enough, I prefer the HSS >blades. But for 30mm of SS, I'd take the carbide. > >Nick How rigid is rigid though Nick? I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to. http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html Makes parting an absolute breeze. To be honest I use carbide turning tools almost exclusively on the Myford, except for screwcutting, and one toolholder with a sandvik coromant DCMT insert is practically a permanent fixture on the toolpost. Mind you I'm a lazy bugger too<g>. I hardly ever alter the spindle speed from the Myford top-end of 640rpm, and cut pretty much everything from 4" diameter mild steel to 1mm silver steel on this speed, all with the dcmt insert, just altering feed and depth of cut. Peter

	#3
Nick Mueller	Re: Parting tool recommendations Peter Neill wrote: > How rigid is rigid though Nick? How rigid is a Myford? I don't know, but I think she isn't as bad as the small Chinese cheapies. > I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for > everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last > year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to. > http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html Yep, this type of inserts. And no, below say 10mm I prefer the HSS. The carbide has higher cutting forces and would bend something delicate (say a 2mm round) more than cut it. > Makes parting an absolute breeze. Full ACK for something over 20mm or hard to cut like SS. Parting off 40mm with HSS is an adventure, with carbide, it is a snap. As HSS, I'm using the Komet part off blades. If you stone a small radius on the right edge, they cut really nice. But, they have to be better aligned than the carbide part off tools. Nick

	#5
Ian	Re: Parting tool recommendations "Peter Neill" <panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message > > I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for > everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last > year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to. > http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html > > Makes parting an absolute breeze. > Thanks for the really useful replies It was the Q-cut tool I had in the back of my mind but had forgotten its actual name. My only concern would be the 2,5mm width of cut, I am used to 1.6mm which the Boxford copes easily with, it also reduces wastage. Another advantage of the loose HSS blade type is that only the minimum length of bit need to be projecting which helps rigidity, I have also parted in to about 50mm depth on 150mm diameter Delrin by extending the bit in stages. Is the Q-cut an adaptation of another manufactures double ended holder I wonder? if so I might buy one from J&L, make two, and see if anyone wants to go 'halves'. Ian in Cheshire

	#6
John Stevenson	Re: Parting tool recommendations On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 13:22:07 +0100, "Ian" <elanman99@yahoo.com> wrote: > >"Peter Neill" <panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message >> >> I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for >> everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last >> year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to. >> http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html >> >> Makes parting an absolute breeze. >> >Thanks for the really useful replies > >It was the Q-cut tool I had in the back of my mind but had forgotten its >actual name. > >My only concern would be the 2,5mm width of cut, I am used to 1.6mm which >the Boxford copes easily with, it also reduces wastage. Another advantage of >the loose HSS blade type is that only the minimum length of bit need to be >projecting which helps rigidity, I have also parted in to about 50mm depth >on 150mm diameter Delrin by extending the bit in stages. > >Is the Q-cut an adaptation of another manufactures double ended holder I >wonder? if so I might buy one from J&L, make two, and see if anyone wants to >go 'halves'. > >Ian in Cheshire > Ian if you can wait until the Bristol show next month then visit Jenny at JB Cutting tools. She usually has different sorts on the stall at good prices. I bought a double ended on off her for about £30 and the inserts are also double sided and cheaper than the single sided ones like Greenwood sells. This is a 1.6mm wide blade and it cuts great. Only problem with mine was the blade is tall, no problem to my lathes but for a small lathe you would have to chop it in half then reduce the height but the tip cost would more than pay for the hassle of doing that.

	#8
Ian	Re: Parting tool recommendations "John Stevenson" <john@stevenson-engineers.co.uk> wrote in message > > Ian if you can wait until the Bristol show next month then visit Jenny > at JB Cutting tools. > She usually has different sorts on the stall at good prices. > I bought a double ended on off her for about £30 and the inserts are > also double sided and cheaper than the single sided ones like > Greenwood sells. > This is a 1.6mm wide blade and it cuts great. > > Only problem with mine was the blade is tall, no problem to my lathes > but for a small lathe you would have to chop it in half then reduce > the height but the tip cost would more than pay for the hassle of > doing that. John I could wait for the Bristol Show but probably wont, due to impatience. I would definitely prefer something narrower than 2.5mm. Do you know how machinable are the blades that hold the tip. Are the double ended tips a compromise over the single types I wonder? Ian on the Cheshire Plain

	#10
Ian	Re: Parting tool recommendations "Nick Mueller" <muellernick@gmx.de> wrote in message news:2941996.azxyPcSpYH@yadro.de... > Ian wrote: > >> Are the double ended tips a compromise over the single types I wonder? > > The other end will cut (or rub) too at deeper cuts. > > > Nick I never thought of that Nick, but you are right. HSS cutting tools rub fine but my experience with tips on SS is that the cutting edge can break off if the job is rotating in the wrong direction. Ian

	#11
David Littlewood	Re: Parting tool recommendations In article <47m8a353i8k6favmp9icktmn177i94reku@4ax.com>, Peter Neill <panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> writes >On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 09:16:20 +0200, Nick Mueller <muellernick@gmx.de> >wrote: > >>Ian wrote: >> >>> I have to make a quantity of thickish washers from 30mm SS barstock, upto >>> now I have been using an Eclipse HSS blade (about 1.5x8mm) holder but >>> remember reading posts about part off tooling that uses carbide inserts. >> >>Be aware, that you need a rigid lathe for the carbide part off tools. >>Seems that you don't need a specific manufacturer. But most recommend >>inserts of the SP.. type. >> >>I have one, but I'm not fully convinced. Often enough, I prefer the HSS >>blades. But for 30mm of SS, I'd take the carbide. >> >>Nick > > >How rigid is rigid though Nick? > >I only have a little Myford and I use a carbide parting tool for >everything. I bought the Q-cut tool from Greenwood at a show last >year, and wouldn't go back to HSS unless i absolutely had to. >http://www.greenwood-tools.co.uk/ish...shopscr23.html > >Makes parting an absolute breeze. > >To be honest I use carbide turning tools almost exclusively on the >Myford, except for screwcutting, and one toolholder with a sandvik >coromant DCMT insert is practically a permanent fixture on the >toolpost. > >Mind you I'm a lazy bugger too<g>. >I hardly ever alter the spindle speed from the Myford top-end of >640rpm, and cut pretty much everything from 4" diameter mild steel to >1mm silver steel on this speed, all with the dcmt insert, just >altering feed and depth of cut. > >Peter I entirely agree with Peter - I have been using the Q-cut for a couple of years on my S7, and you would have to shoot me to take it away. Yesterday I was parting off some 30mm MS, and forgot to drop down from 615 to 200 rpm (as I would normally) but the Q-cut sliced through without pausing for breath. I have even seen the Myford men demonstrating parting off under PXF using one - something I can't imagine doing with a conventional tool. The only time I have gone back to conventional tools recently was to part off some nylon bar, where I worked out that my narrow HS tool would just get me 3 pieces instead of 2. David -- David Littlewood

	#12
Nick Mueller	Re: Parting tool recommendations David Littlewood wrote: > I have even seen the Myford men > demonstrating parting off under PXF using one - something I can't > imagine doing with a conventional tool. Does parting off of 35mm with a HSS (Komet blade 1.9mm) under power feed qualify? Nick