New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please

Hi all,
Ive managed to finally by a mill, <Big Grin>. only a couple of oops
moments: Oops number 1: I was looking a 42" sized brigeports or
similar, and Ive ended up with a TOS FNK25, but it was cheaper than
Ive seen any Bridgeports go for, so thats ok.(Im pretty sure it will
fit in the garage, though getting it through the door might be
'interesting')
The main oops is its 3 phase... Id rather not spend more on a method
of running it than I did on the mill, so I think just some capacitors
are in order. Ive not done this before (I chickened out on my harrison
and bought a Newton Tesla Drive, in that case the lathe was free, so I
could sort of justify it...) so hints tips etc would be nice.
What size caps do I need, is there a nice 'rule of thumb', and will
the capacitance vary with load?
Am I likely to have problems with the motor running it on a 'static
convertor'? I dont think Ill be doing production style metal hogging
(at least not yet), but I dont want to have to 'baby' it (one reason I
bought a big un).
I do have a spare 1hp 3ph motor (from the harrison) would it be a good
idea to add this into the mix somewhere?

cheers

Dave
(who has until thursday morning to move ALL the heavy machinery and
stuff he already has around so theres floor space for the new arrival!)

On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 05:39:26 -0700, dave sanderson
<david.sanderson@bem.fki-et.com> wrote:

>Hi all,
>Ive managed to finally by a mill, <Big Grin>. only a couple of oops
>moments: Oops number 1: I was looking a 42" sized brigeports or
>similar, and Ive ended up with a TOS FNK25, but it was cheaper than
>Ive seen any Bridgeports go for, so thats ok.(Im pretty sure it will
>fit in the garage, though getting it through the door might be
>'interesting')
>The main oops is its 3 phase... Id rather not spend more on a method
>of running it than I did on the mill, so I think just some capacitors
>are in order. Ive not done this before (I chickened out on my harrison
>and bought a Newton Tesla Drive, in that case the lathe was free, so I
>could sort of justify it...) so hints tips etc would be nice.
>What size caps do I need, is there a nice 'rule of thumb', and will
>the capacitance vary with load?
>Am I likely to have problems with the motor running it on a 'static
>convertor'? I dont think Ill be doing production style metal hogging
>(at least not yet), but I dont want to have to 'baby' it (one reason I
>bought a big un).
>I do have a spare 1hp 3ph motor (from the harrison) would it be a good
>idea to add this into the mix somewhere?
>
>cheers
>
>Dave
>(who has until thursday morning to move ALL the heavy machinery and
>stuff he already has around so theres floor space for the new arrival!)

Dave

I have a home made 3 phase converter that is surplus to requirements -
availble for a small fee. It previously ran my 2.5HP Elliott
horizontal mill before being replaced by a more robust Transwave SMA
that I bought for the new lathe.

A previous mill was run with a capacitor and relay start mechanism
built from the book "Electric Montors in the Home Workshop". Still
works a treat in it's own home and only cost £20. The downside is that
it requires a full rewire of the mill where the converter option is a
plug-and-play route.

Charles

On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:26:19 +0100, Charles Ping
<littlewrongs@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

>On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 05:39:26 -0700, dave sanderson
><david.sanderson@bem.fki-et.com> wrote:
>
>>Hi all,
>>Ive managed to finally by a mill, <Big Grin>. only a couple of oops
>>moments: Oops number 1: I was looking a 42" sized brigeports or
>>similar, and Ive ended up with a TOS FNK25, but it was cheaper than
>>Ive seen any Bridgeports go for, so thats ok.(Im pretty sure it will
>>fit in the garage, though getting it through the door might be
>>'interesting')
>>The main oops is its 3 phase... Id rather not spend more on a method
>>of running it than I did on the mill, so I think just some capacitors
>>are in order. Ive not done this before (I chickened out on my harrison
>>and bought a Newton Tesla Drive, in that case the lathe was free, so I
>>could sort of justify it...) so hints tips etc would be nice.
>>What size caps do I need, is there a nice 'rule of thumb', and will
>>the capacitance vary with load?
>>Am I likely to have problems with the motor running it on a 'static
>>convertor'? I dont think Ill be doing production style metal hogging
>>(at least not yet), but I dont want to have to 'baby' it (one reason I
>>bought a big un).
>>I do have a spare 1hp 3ph motor (from the harrison) would it be a good
>>idea to add this into the mix somewhere?
>>
>>cheers
>>
>>Dave
>>(who has until thursday morning to move ALL the heavy machinery and
>>stuff he already has around so theres floor space for the new arrival!)
>
>
>Dave
>
>I have a home made 3 phase converter that is surplus to requirements -
>availble for a small fee. It previously ran my 2.5HP Elliott
>horizontal mill before being replaced by a more robust Transwave SMA
>that I bought for the new lathe.
>
>A previous mill was run with a capacitor and relay start mechanism
>built from the book "Electric Montors in the Home Workshop". Still
>works a treat in it's own home and only cost £20. The downside is that
>it requires a full rewire of the mill where the converter option is a
>plug-and-play route.
>
>Charles
>

Dave

My bridgy runs a 2-speed motor just fine on a static converter from
transwave, just have to flick the switch to bring in more capacitors
to start it on the higher speed.

The motor is only 2Hp - I suspect the TOS may be more - and I bought
the 4Hp/3kw converter on the recommendation of Power Capacitors.

Peter

'noon,
would have replied eariler but google groups seems bust (I know, I
ought to get a proper news account...).
I think the spindle motor is 3.5Kw, but other places seem to think its
2.5Kw, on that basis I think your convertor might be a little small
Charles? Its 2 speed, unless there are a lot of belts - 16 speeds. I
suspect theres a suds pump too. Ill know more tommorow when I get it,
and report back.
There doesnt seem to be a lot of info on these on the net, are they
really uncommon?

on a slightly different note was this:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1
a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain
scrap!

Dave
(Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!)

--
small.planes
------------------------------------------------------------------------
small.planes's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=11778
View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=714551

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 07:09:09 -0500, small.planes
<small.planes.2tx2wo@rcgroups.com> wrote:

<snip>
>
>on a slightly different note was this:
>http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1
>a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain
>scrap!
>
>Dave
>(Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!)

Oooh I quite like those.
Stumbled across a site with some information on it about these a while
ago. They look like a nice rigid, extremely versatile piece of kit,
capable of all sorts of things.

Here's a link to the site mentioned, with some photos of the Abene in
various operating modes.

http://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/abene.htm

Peter

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:05:37 +0100, Peter Neill
<panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

>On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 07:09:09 -0500, small.planes
><small.planes.2tx2wo@rcgroups.com> wrote:
>
><snip>
>>
>>on a slightly different note was this:
>>http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1
>>a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain
>>scrap!
>>
>>Dave
>>(Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!)
>
>
>Oooh I quite like those.
>Stumbled across a site with some information on it about these a while
>ago. They look like a nice rigid, extremely versatile piece of kit,
>capable of all sorts of things.
>
>Here's a link to the site mentioned, with some photos of the Abene in
>various operating modes.
>
>http://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/abene.htm
>
>Peter

Aaahhh
0.99 p final bid.
Shall we upset the colonials ? <bg>

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 07:09:09 -0500, small.planes
<small.planes.2tx2wo@rcgroups.com> wrote:

>
>'noon,
>would have replied eariler but google groups seems bust (I know, I
>ought to get a proper news account...).
>I think the spindle motor is 3.5Kw, but other places seem to think its
>2.5Kw, on that basis I think your convertor might be a little small
>Charles? Its 2 speed, unless there are a lot of belts - 16 speeds. I
>suspect theres a suds pump too. Ill know more tommorow when I get it,
>and report back.
>There doesnt seem to be a lot of info on these on the net, are they
>really uncommon?
>
>on a slightly different note was this:
>http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1
>a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain
>scrap!
>
>Dave
>(Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!)

Dave

I agree that it's probably too small - it didn't like my 3HP lathe
but the gearing on that was heavier that a turret mill.
2 speed means that a cheap capacitor & relay approach might not work.
2 speed motor wiring can be very confusing. I remotored my Bridgeport
with a modern metric framed 1.5HP flange mounting motor. Fitted
beautifully inside the original "pancake" motor base plate. You might
consider that sort of approach if you get stuck.

Charles

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 13:33:27 GMT, John Stevenson
<john@stevenson-engineers.co.uk> wrote:

>On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:05:37 +0100, Peter Neill
><panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 07:09:09 -0500, small.planes
>><small.planes.2tx2wo@rcgroups.com> wrote:
>>
>><snip>
>>>
>>>on a slightly different note was this:
>>>http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1
>>>a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain
>>>scrap!
>>>
>>>Dave
>>>(Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!)
>>
>>
>>Oooh I quite like those.
>>Stumbled across a site with some information on it about these a while
>>ago. They look like a nice rigid, extremely versatile piece of kit,
>>capable of all sorts of things.
>>
>>Here's a link to the site mentioned, with some photos of the Abene in
>>various operating modes.
>>
>>http://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/abene.htm
>>
>>Peter
>
>Aaahhh
>0.99 p final bid.
>Shall we upset the colonials ? <bg>

But of course, it would seem rude not too <G>
Would you like to set the bait or shall I ?

Peter

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:15:36 +0100, Peter Neill
<panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

>>
>>Aaahhh
>>0.99 p final bid.
>>Shall we upset the colonials ? <bg>
>
>
>But of course, it would seem rude not too <G>
>Would you like to set the bait or shall I ?
>
>Peter

I see malbenbut has already beaten us to it on the PM forum.

Peter

John Stevenson <john@stevenson-engineers.co.uk> wrote:

>Aaahhh
>0.99 p final bid.
>Shall we upset the colonials ? <bg>

Why should we be upset?

I hope Gundy53 give it a good home.

Wes

just thought Id post a photo

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/DSC_1598.jpg

Ive not quite figured out how Im going to turn it round so I can use
it tho....

think I need a bigger garage....

Dave

"dave sanderson" <david.sanderson@bem.fki-et.com> wrote in message
news:1185483310.665057.48840@w3g2000hsg.googlegrou ps.com...
> just thought Id post a photo
>
> http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/DSC_1598.jpg
>
> Ive not quite figured out how Im going to turn it round so I can use
> it tho....
>
> think I need a bigger garage....
>
> Dave
>

Dead easy! Crowbar to lift a corner, put a 1/2" or 3/4" bar under it
as a roller, and spin it. Once you have it balanced on the roller it's
suprising how easy it is to move heavy weights.

AWEM

	#1
dave sanderson	New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please Hi all, Ive managed to finally by a mill, <Big Grin>. only a couple of oops moments: Oops number 1: I was looking a 42" sized brigeports or similar, and Ive ended up with a TOS FNK25, but it was cheaper than Ive seen any Bridgeports go for, so thats ok.(Im pretty sure it will fit in the garage, though getting it through the door might be 'interesting') The main oops is its 3 phase... Id rather not spend more on a method of running it than I did on the mill, so I think just some capacitors are in order. Ive not done this before (I chickened out on my harrison and bought a Newton Tesla Drive, in that case the lathe was free, so I could sort of justify it...) so hints tips etc would be nice. What size caps do I need, is there a nice 'rule of thumb', and will the capacitance vary with load? Am I likely to have problems with the motor running it on a 'static convertor'? I dont think Ill be doing production style metal hogging (at least not yet), but I dont want to have to 'baby' it (one reason I bought a big un). I do have a spare 1hp 3ph motor (from the harrison) would it be a good idea to add this into the mix somewhere? cheers Dave (who has until thursday morning to move ALL the heavy machinery and stuff he already has around so theres floor space for the new arrival!)

	#2
Charles Ping	Re: New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 05:39:26 -0700, dave sanderson <david.sanderson@bem.fki-et.com> wrote: >Hi all, >Ive managed to finally by a mill, <Big Grin>. only a couple of oops >moments: Oops number 1: I was looking a 42" sized brigeports or >similar, and Ive ended up with a TOS FNK25, but it was cheaper than >Ive seen any Bridgeports go for, so thats ok.(Im pretty sure it will >fit in the garage, though getting it through the door might be >'interesting') >The main oops is its 3 phase... Id rather not spend more on a method >of running it than I did on the mill, so I think just some capacitors >are in order. Ive not done this before (I chickened out on my harrison >and bought a Newton Tesla Drive, in that case the lathe was free, so I >could sort of justify it...) so hints tips etc would be nice. >What size caps do I need, is there a nice 'rule of thumb', and will >the capacitance vary with load? >Am I likely to have problems with the motor running it on a 'static >convertor'? I dont think Ill be doing production style metal hogging >(at least not yet), but I dont want to have to 'baby' it (one reason I >bought a big un). >I do have a spare 1hp 3ph motor (from the harrison) would it be a good >idea to add this into the mix somewhere? > >cheers > >Dave >(who has until thursday morning to move ALL the heavy machinery and >stuff he already has around so theres floor space for the new arrival!) Dave I have a home made 3 phase converter that is surplus to requirements - availble for a small fee. It previously ran my 2.5HP Elliott horizontal mill before being replaced by a more robust Transwave SMA that I bought for the new lathe. A previous mill was run with a capacitor and relay start mechanism built from the book "Electric Montors in the Home Workshop". Still works a treat in it's own home and only cost £20. The downside is that it requires a full rewire of the mill where the converter option is a plug-and-play route. Charles

	#3
Peter Neill	Re: New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:26:19 +0100, Charles Ping <littlewrongs@hotmail.co.uk> wrote: >On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 05:39:26 -0700, dave sanderson ><david.sanderson@bem.fki-et.com> wrote: > >>Hi all, >>Ive managed to finally by a mill, <Big Grin>. only a couple of oops >>moments: Oops number 1: I was looking a 42" sized brigeports or >>similar, and Ive ended up with a TOS FNK25, but it was cheaper than >>Ive seen any Bridgeports go for, so thats ok.(Im pretty sure it will >>fit in the garage, though getting it through the door might be >>'interesting') >>The main oops is its 3 phase... Id rather not spend more on a method >>of running it than I did on the mill, so I think just some capacitors >>are in order. Ive not done this before (I chickened out on my harrison >>and bought a Newton Tesla Drive, in that case the lathe was free, so I >>could sort of justify it...) so hints tips etc would be nice. >>What size caps do I need, is there a nice 'rule of thumb', and will >>the capacitance vary with load? >>Am I likely to have problems with the motor running it on a 'static >>convertor'? I dont think Ill be doing production style metal hogging >>(at least not yet), but I dont want to have to 'baby' it (one reason I >>bought a big un). >>I do have a spare 1hp 3ph motor (from the harrison) would it be a good >>idea to add this into the mix somewhere? >> >>cheers >> >>Dave >>(who has until thursday morning to move ALL the heavy machinery and >>stuff he already has around so theres floor space for the new arrival!) > > >Dave > >I have a home made 3 phase converter that is surplus to requirements - >availble for a small fee. It previously ran my 2.5HP Elliott >horizontal mill before being replaced by a more robust Transwave SMA >that I bought for the new lathe. > >A previous mill was run with a capacitor and relay start mechanism >built from the book "Electric Montors in the Home Workshop". Still >works a treat in it's own home and only cost £20. The downside is that >it requires a full rewire of the mill where the converter option is a >plug-and-play route. > >Charles > Dave My bridgy runs a 2-speed motor just fine on a static converter from transwave, just have to flick the switch to bring in more capacitors to start it on the higher speed. The motor is only 2Hp - I suspect the TOS may be more - and I bought the 4Hp/3kw converter on the recommendation of Power Capacitors. Peter

	#4
small.planes	Re: New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please 'noon, would have replied eariler but google groups seems bust (I know, I ought to get a proper news account...). I think the spindle motor is 3.5Kw, but other places seem to think its 2.5Kw, on that basis I think your convertor might be a little small Charles? Its 2 speed, unless there are a lot of belts - 16 speeds. I suspect theres a suds pump too. Ill know more tommorow when I get it, and report back. There doesnt seem to be a lot of info on these on the net, are they really uncommon? on a slightly different note was this: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1 a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain scrap! Dave (Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!) -- small.planes ------------------------------------------------------------------------ small.planes's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=11778 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=714551

	#6
John Stevenson	Re: New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:05:37 +0100, Peter Neill <panuno95-ukrec@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 07:09:09 -0500, small.planes ><small.planes.2tx2wo@rcgroups.com> wrote: > ><snip> >> >>on a slightly different note was this: >>http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...8115&rd=1&rd=1 >>a bargin or what? It has to be worth more than that as just plain >>scrap! >> >>Dave >>(Nearly finished moving things, only 1 car to go!) > > >Oooh I quite like those. >Stumbled across a site with some information on it about these a while >ago. They look like a nice rigid, extremely versatile piece of kit, >capable of all sorts of things. > >Here's a link to the site mentioned, with some photos of the Abene in >various operating modes. > >http://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/abene.htm > >Peter Aaahhh 0.99 p final bid. Shall we upset the colonials ? <bg>

	#12
Andrew Mawson	Re: New Mill :) oops it 3 phase... advice please "dave sanderson" <david.sanderson@bem.fki-et.com> wrote in message news:1185483310.665057.48840@w3g2000hsg.googlegrou ps.com... > just thought Id post a photo > > http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/DSC_1598.jpg > > Ive not quite figured out how Im going to turn it round so I can use > it tho.... > > think I need a bigger garage.... > > Dave > Dead easy! Crowbar to lift a corner, put a 1/2" or 3/4" bar under it as a roller, and spin it. Once you have it balanced on the roller it's suprising how easy it is to move heavy weights. AWEM