Me

Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks!
They're going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.

Philip

Triffid

Me wrote:
> Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks!
> They're going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.
>
> Philip

Little more information please? Are they reprinting them? I've seen
Bumblebees go for £200 on ebay.

David Lee

Triffid wrote...
> Me wrote:
>> Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks! They're
>> going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.

> Little more information please? Are they reprinting them? I've seen
> Bumblebees go for £200 on ebay.

I spoke to the commissioning editor last year about the availability of John
Alttingham's British Bats volume. My understanding is that their policy is
not to reprint. Also the hardback print run is limited to only a couple of
thousand copies. It's a crazy policy - IMHO bordering on the criminal -
designed to keep up their value to the collecting fraternity. I can't see
what on earth Harper Collins have to gain by this idiotic policy, since the
high prices only set in after the books are out of print. It's disastrous
for genuine wildlife workers - Altringham's "Bats" book should be
well-thumbed on the bookshelf of every British bat enthusiast and not stuck
unread and pristine in some collector's display case!

There have been some attempts, in the past, at reprinting NN volumes by
another publisher but AFAIK this wasn't very successful and they were only
able to reproduce the colour plates in poorly produced black and white.
These seem to turn up quite frequently in second hand bookshops around here.

Perhaps Collins should follow the lead of OUP - a textbook on Bat ecology
also by Altringham went out of print but is now printed on demand at a very
reasonable price - I ordered a new copy for about £22 only last week.
Obviously it takes 4-6 weeks to be printed, bound and delivered, but it's a
great idea.

David

Triffid

David Lee wrote:
> Triffid wrote...
>
>>Me wrote:
>>
>>>Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks! They're
>>>going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.
>
>
>>Little more information please? Are they reprinting them? I've seen
>>Bumblebees go for £200 on ebay.
>
>
> I spoke to the commissioning editor last year about the availability of John
> Alttingham's British Bats volume. My understanding is that their policy is
> not to reprint. Also the hardback print run is limited to only a couple of
> thousand copies. It's a crazy policy - IMHO bordering on the criminal -
> designed to keep up their value to the collecting fraternity. I can't see
> what on earth Harper Collins have to gain by this idiotic policy, since the
> high prices only set in after the books are out of print. It's disastrous
> for genuine wildlife workers - Altringham's "Bats" book should be
> well-thumbed on the bookshelf of every British bat enthusiast and not stuck
> unread and pristine in some collector's display case!
>
> There have been some attempts, in the past, at reprinting NN volumes by
> another publisher but AFAIK this wasn't very successful and they were only
> able to reproduce the colour plates in poorly produced black and white.
> These seem to turn up quite frequently in second hand bookshops around here.
>
> Perhaps Collins should follow the lead of OUP - a textbook on Bat ecology
> also by Altringham went out of print but is now printed on demand at a very
> reasonable price - I ordered a new copy for about £22 only last week.
> Obviously it takes 4-6 weeks to be printed, bound and delivered, but it's a
> great idea.
>
> David
>
>

I can only agree about the stupidity. My copy of Bumblebees cost £25 on
ebay for a dog-eared but usable copy which had probably been discarded
by a short-sighted library for 10p. I'm not a collector, I have a
specific interest, as with yourself and bats. I think this probably
makes us easy targets. Ebay also host people making a living out of
merely copying the covers of this definitive series ffs.

In the long run however this policy must be detrimental to the interests
of education in particular and wildlife in general. I would imagine that
the authors' estates aren't too happy either.

Perhaps a camapign for a general reprint might be successful? A word
from Oddie or Attenborough might have more clout.

Triffid

Triffid wrote:
> Me wrote:
>
>> Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks!
>> They're going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.
>>
>> Philip
>
>
> Little more information please? Are they reprinting them? I've seen
> Bumblebees go for £200 on ebay.

Later reply to own post.

It seems that Collins had indeed revived the New Naturalist title,
although the books themselves are mostly not reprints, but completely
new volumes (in my case at least), and bats isn't among the lucky
winners. £25 paperback, £45 hardback. I was just going to say that
that's a large chunk of student grant, how behind the times am I?

Still a must have Christmas pressie though.

http://www.collins.co.uk/books.aspx?group=80

David Lee

Triffid wrote...
> It seems that Collins had indeed revived the New Naturalist title,
> although the books themselves are mostly not reprints, but completely new
> volumes (in my case at least), and bats isn't among the lucky winners. £25
> paperback, £45 hardback. I was just going to say that that's a large chunk
> of student grant, how behind the times am I?
>
> Still a must have Christmas pressie though.

None are reprints - where titles are the same as the original NN series the
texts are completely new.

I see that Michael Majerus' "Moths" is stall available in paperback at
£19.99. That's another cracking book - it's written in the same sort of
style as Altringham's "British Bats" - in textbook style for the "ordinary"
naturalist reader. It's unusual to find books like this these days - they
mostly seem to be "stamp collecting" style field guides or based on wildlife
"trivia" facts with very few that deal with specific aspects of the subject
in great detail! I've been patiently waiting for the new NN "Fungi" volume
in the hope that it would be in the same style but was disappointed when I
finally found it since it seems to fall into the second category above with
the detailed treatment of mycology limited to an introduction similar to
what you would find in a good field guide.

David

Malcolm

In article <43a18e59@212.67.96.135>, Triffid <spamme@microsoft.com>
writes
>David Lee wrote:
>> Triffid wrote...
>>
>>>Me wrote:
>>>
>>>>Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks!
>>>>They're going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.
>>
>>>Little more information please? Are they reprinting them? I've seen
>>>Bumblebees go for £200 on ebay.
>> I spoke to the commissioning editor last year about the
>>availability of John Alttingham's British Bats volume. My
>>understanding is that their policy is not to reprint. Also the
>>hardback print run is limited to only a couple of thousand copies.
>>It's a crazy policy - IMHO bordering on the criminal - designed to
>>keep up their value to the collecting fraternity. I can't see what
>>on earth Harper Collins have to gain by this idiotic policy, since the
>>high prices only set in after the books are out of print. It's
>>disastrous for genuine wildlife workers - Altringham's "Bats" book
>>should be well-thumbed on the bookshelf of every British bat
>>enthusiast and not stuck unread and pristine in some collector's display case!

But that doesn't matter. Genuine wildlife workers can buy the paperback
edition for £25.

>> There have been some attempts, in the past, at reprinting NN volumes
>>by another publisher but AFAIK this wasn't very successful and they
>>were only able to reproduce the colour plates in poorly produced
>>black and white. These seem to turn up quite frequently in second
>>hand bookshops around here.

Bloomsbury Press.

>> Perhaps Collins should follow the lead of OUP - a textbook on Bat
>>ecology also by Altringham went out of print but is now printed on
>>demand at a very reasonable price - I ordered a new copy for about
>>£22 only last week. Obviously it takes 4-6 weeks to be printed, bound
>>and delivered, but it's a great idea.
>> David
>
>I can only agree about the stupidity. My copy of Bumblebees cost £25 on
>ebay for a dog-eared but usable copy which had probably been discarded
>by a short-sighted library for 10p. I'm not a collector, I have a
>specific interest, as with yourself and bats. I think this probably
>makes us easy targets. Ebay also host people making a living out of
>merely copying the covers of this definitive series ffs.
>
>In the long run however this policy must be detrimental to the
>interests of education in particular and wildlife in general. I would
>imagine that the authors' estates aren't too happy either.
>
Authors agree to write the books for the royalty offered by Collins. The
fact that books, not just NN, sometimes but by no means always, climb in
price on the secondhand market is merely reflecting market forces. No,
the author doesn't benefit, though they could always buy some extra
copies at their author's discount price and hoard them until the price
rises :-)

>Perhaps a camapign for a general reprint might be successful? A word
>from Oddie or Attenborough might have more clout.

Collins will do what they think will be profitable, nothing else. In
fact, a number of titles have effectively been reprinted and updated by
the publishing of new books on the same subjects. There are three in the
series on Amphibians and Reptiles, for example.

--
Malcolm

David Lee

"Malcolm" wrote...

> ... But that doesn't matter. Genuine wildlife workers can buy the
> paperback edition for £25.

It does matter! The paperback print-run is much larger but still limited
and AFAIK the "Britsh Bats2 volume is now totally out of print in both
bindings.

> ... Collins will do what they think will be profitable, nothing else. In
> fact, a number of titles have effectively been reprinted and updated by
> the publishing of new books on the same subjects. There are three in the
> series on Amphibians and Reptiles, for example.

This is where it all seems to be so stupid - the demand for these volumes
greatly exceeds the volume of the print run and so Collins could make a much
greater profit simply by printing more copies , even if only in paper - it
seems as though they are more interested in the kudos of producing
collectors items at no added profit, which strikes me as a weird commercial
practice!

Collins are terribly inconsistent - if you look at even the latest edition
of the "Mammals" Field Guide the Preface still starts with the statement
that "This book is part of a brace on European Mammals: the first volume is
a Field Guide and the second Evolution and Behaviour." The Field Guide
continues in print for the "stamp collectors" (although the latest printing
is only different in a new pretty binding and hasn't been corrected at all -
Coypu and Wallabies are still apparently extant British species but the
soprano pipistrelle still doesn't exist!) however the more interesting
partner volume was never reprinted at all and it took me a couple of years
to find a second hand copy!

David

BAC

"Malcolm" <Malcolm@indaal.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:NbgCgVTn+moDFwXm@indaal.demon.co.uk...
>
<snip>
>
> And wallabies are still extant in Britain!
>

That's good to hear. Did I read somewhere that some had been spotted in
Angus's neck of the woods? Protected by the NP status, no doubt.

Craven

"Me" <nospam@spam.org> wrote in message
news:dnre83$kjn$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks! They're
> going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.

Ron Porley & Nick Hodgetts 97 - Mosses & Liverworts NEW £40.00
Brian Spooner & Peter Roberts 96 - Fungi NEW £40.00
Angus Lunn 95 - Northumberland NEW £45.00
Peter J. Haywood 94 - Seashore NEW £45.00
John Altringham 93 - Bats NEW £75.00
Derek Ratcliffe 92 - Lakeland NEW £75.00

Malcolm

In article <1134724525.8435.0@nnrp-t71-03.news.uk.clara.net>, BAC
<casswalk@NOSPAMdircon.co.uk> writes
>
>"Malcolm" <Malcolm@indaal.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:NbgCgVTn+moDFwXm@indaal.demon.co.uk...
>>
><snip>
>>
>> And wallabies are still extant in Britain!
>>
>
>That's good to hear. Did I read somewhere that some had been spotted in
>Angus's neck of the woods? Protected by the NP status, no doubt.
>
I suspect their status viz-a-viz protection is a somewhat grey area :-)

The summer before last one turned up on Islay, lying dead beside the
main road close to the airport. There was some discussion whether it had
been living here undetected for an unknown period, stowed away on an
aircraft or found dead beside the A82 where it runs past Loch Lomond and
brought here as a merry jape. The last seemed the most likely! It made
the newspapers and TV, the latter because a BBC Scotland TV journalist
comes from Islay and visitrs quite regularly taking the opportunity to
record various snippets for subsequent broadcasting.

--
Malcolm

Malcolm

In article <dnuct0$p33$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>, Craven
<crfishwick@hotmail.com> writes
>
>"Me" <nospam@spam.org> wrote in message
>news:dnre83$kjn$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>> Crikey, have you seen the price increase on next years hardbacks! They're
>> going up to £45. Looking forward to the Gower though.
>
> Ron Porley & Nick Hodgetts 97 - Mosses & Liverworts NEW £40.00
> Brian Spooner & Peter Roberts 96 - Fungi NEW £40.00
> Angus Lunn 95 - Northumberland NEW £45.00
> Peter J. Haywood 94 - Seashore NEW £45.00
> John Altringham 93 - Bats NEW £75.00
> Derek Ratcliffe 92 - Lakeland NEW £75.00
>
Except that those higher prices are not the published price, which was
what the OP mentioned, but merely what booksellers think they can get
for new copies now.

--
Malcolm