Uniform

I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but
do not let the students do so.

The reason given to me today is that they do not want students to be
mistaken for qualified nurses.

Of the reasons given for wearing scrubs, infection control and comfort
I would query at least infection control - I would not say that I am
any better at laudering my uniform than anyone else, and my uniform is
no more comfortable than theirs.

Another big issue I feel is that by being made to stand out I will not
be integrated within the team, and will always be an outsider. Also the
hospital coridor is full of diagrams of uniforms, would a patient's
relative come to me first as the most identifiable nurse? As for being
confused for qualified staff - what about the healthcare assistants
wearing scrubs? What stops them from being mistaken for qualified
nurses? Am am sure that they will know more than me in many areas, but
the risk of drs asking them to do something they cannot will still
apply.

But then I can think of an answer for anything sometimes! I think
mainly the infection control angle is the most important, followed by a
desire to fit in as part of the team.

Any advise and comments most welcome.

"Caol MacThòmais" wrote:
>I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but do
>not let the students do so.
>
> The reason given to me today is that they do not want students to be
> mistaken for qualified nurses.
>
> Of the reasons given for wearing scrubs, infection control and comfort I
> would query at least infection control - I would not say that I am any
> better at laudering my uniform than anyone else, and my uniform is no more
> comfortable than theirs.
>
> Another big issue I feel is that by being made to stand out I will not be
> integrated within the team, and will always be an outsider. Also the
> hospital coridor is full of diagrams of uniforms, would a patient's
> relative come to me first as the most identifiable nurse? As for being
> confused for qualified staff - what about the healthcare assistants
> wearing scrubs? What stops them from being mistaken for qualified nurses?
> Am am sure that they will know more than me in many areas, but the risk of
> drs asking them to do something they cannot will still apply.
>
> But then I can think of an answer for anything sometimes! I think mainly
> the infection control angle is the most important, followed by a desire to
> fit in as part of the team.
>
> Any advise and comments most welcome.

No point in starting a battle you cannot possibly win. Just accept that it
is their strategy for keeping students in their place, and they are unable
to admit that to you or themselves.

On 2007-03-01 18:36:51 +0000, "Curious" <?> said:

> "Caol MacThòmais" wrote:
>> I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but do
>> not let the students do so.

>> I think mainly the infection control angle is the most important,
>> followed by a desire to fit in as part of the team.
>
> No point in starting a battle you cannot possibly win.

I do like a good argument

. And actually I think I have a good
argument *for* students dressing the same as the permanent staff.

> Just accept that it
> is their strategy for keeping students in their place,

that was a consideration, however from a brief meeting with some of the
staff earlier in the week they seem a nice bunch, in many of these
types of things I think there is a lot of 'it's always been done that
way' thinking.

"Caol MacThòmais" wrote:
> I do like a good argument

. And actually I think I have a good argument
> *for* students dressing the same as the permanent staff.

I don't doubt that, but you are not playing on a level playing field. You
are at a disadvantage in the power gradient; this is a 'match' between a
GROUP of registered practitioners who as you say have permanent employee
status, and yourself, a transient, temporary, unregistered, not-employed
student. The dynamics don't seem to be in your favour!

> that was a consideration, however from a brief meeting with some of the
> staff earlier in the week they seem a nice bunch, in many of these types
> of things I think there is a lot of 'it's always been done that way'
> thinking.

I am sure they are very nice people, but they may not remain so if you rock
their boat too much

Have fun!

On Mar 1, 4:46 pm, Caol MacThòmais <caol.macthom...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but
> do not let the students do so.
<snip>

that would be like an Emergency department i worked in at one time

in the good old bad old days of hats the department made a radical
jump put the Nursing staff into scrubs and also decided to make
medical staff wear a uniform the same scrubs but in green rather than
blue ...

these scrubs are different from those worn in theatres etc in the
trust being the lojigma ones and not ordinary cotton ones...

However HCAs and Students in the department wear conventional
uniforms ...

the HCAs because they decided that the HCAs shouldn't be wearing
thesame uniforms as Staff nurses and they couldn't agree on a
different scrub colour ( the male HCAs didn't want lilac and the
female HCAs weren't to enamoured with grey or burgundy and blue, navy
and green were alrady in use by RNs, CNs/NPs and doctors
respectively)...

if in the settign in question scrubs are worn for infection control
reasons - students shoudl were them , if it is because that is the
chosen uniform of thedepartment it makes little or no difference...

Curious wrote:
> "Caol MacThòmais" wrote:
>> I do like a good argument

. And actually I think I have a good argument
>> *for* students dressing the same as the permanent staff.
>
> I don't doubt that, but you are not playing on a level playing field. You
> are at a disadvantage in the power gradient; this is a 'match' between a
> GROUP of registered practitioners who as you say have permanent employee
> status, and yourself, a transient, temporary, unregistered, not-employed
> student. The dynamics don't seem to be in your favour!
>
>> that was a consideration, however from a brief meeting with some of the
>> staff earlier in the week they seem a nice bunch, in many of these types
>> of things I think there is a lot of 'it's always been done that way'
>> thinking.
>
> I am sure they are very nice people, but they may not remain so if you rock
> their boat too much

>
> Have fun!
>
>
I've got some major worries with this which haven't been addressed in
the previous posts. My experience of being in theatre areas is about 11
years out of date so please correct me if I am wrong. Static discharge
can be a major problem in theatre. Pretty much everything entering a
theatre had to be antistatic. (Scrubs are not made out of nylon for a
reason) Where I work the student nurses uniforms are high on artificial
fibres which worries me. My thoughts are there are basic health and
safety and accountability issues involved here. Have the materials which
the uniforms are made from been tested for their antistatic properties?
Has a risk assessment been carried out regarding their use in these
areas? I'd suggest that rather than pursue this argument yourself it'd
be more productive to pass your concerns to one of the trade unions
supporting student nurses. They will have access to far more resources
than you have and enjying a good argument is no substitute for choosing
the correct argument. It may not make them change the policy but you
will have the comfort of knowing that if your uniform sparks your
nearest and dearest will get a payout when you take out the entire
theatre ;-@

	#1
=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Caol_MacTh=F2mais?=	Uniform I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but do not let the students do so. The reason given to me today is that they do not want students to be mistaken for qualified nurses. Of the reasons given for wearing scrubs, infection control and comfort I would query at least infection control - I would not say that I am any better at laudering my uniform than anyone else, and my uniform is no more comfortable than theirs. Another big issue I feel is that by being made to stand out I will not be integrated within the team, and will always be an outsider. Also the hospital coridor is full of diagrams of uniforms, would a patient's relative come to me first as the most identifiable nurse? As for being confused for qualified staff - what about the healthcare assistants wearing scrubs? What stops them from being mistaken for qualified nurses? Am am sure that they will know more than me in many areas, but the risk of drs asking them to do something they cannot will still apply. But then I can think of an answer for anything sometimes! I think mainly the infection control angle is the most important, followed by a desire to fit in as part of the team. Any advise and comments most welcome.

	#2
Curious	Re: Uniform "Caol MacThòmais" wrote: >I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but do >not let the students do so. > > The reason given to me today is that they do not want students to be > mistaken for qualified nurses. > > Of the reasons given for wearing scrubs, infection control and comfort I > would query at least infection control - I would not say that I am any > better at laudering my uniform than anyone else, and my uniform is no more > comfortable than theirs. > > Another big issue I feel is that by being made to stand out I will not be > integrated within the team, and will always be an outsider. Also the > hospital coridor is full of diagrams of uniforms, would a patient's > relative come to me first as the most identifiable nurse? As for being > confused for qualified staff - what about the healthcare assistants > wearing scrubs? What stops them from being mistaken for qualified nurses? > Am am sure that they will know more than me in many areas, but the risk of > drs asking them to do something they cannot will still apply. > > But then I can think of an answer for anything sometimes! I think mainly > the infection control angle is the most important, followed by a desire to > fit in as part of the team. > > Any advise and comments most welcome. No point in starting a battle you cannot possibly win. Just accept that it is their strategy for keeping students in their place, and they are unable to admit that to you or themselves.

	#3
=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Caol_MacTh=F2mais?=	Re: Uniform On 2007-03-01 18:36:51 +0000, "Curious" <?> said: > "Caol MacThòmais" wrote: >> I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but do >> not let the students do so. >> I think mainly the infection control angle is the most important, >> followed by a desire to fit in as part of the team. > > No point in starting a battle you cannot possibly win. I do like a good argument . And actually I think I have a good argument for students dressing the same as the permanent staff. > Just accept that it > is their strategy for keeping students in their place, that was a consideration, however from a brief meeting with some of the staff earlier in the week they seem a nice bunch, in many of these types of things I think there is a lot of 'it's always been done that way' thinking.

	#5
Martyn H	Re: Uniform On Mar 1, 4:46 pm, Caol MacThòmais <caol.macthom...@gmail.com> wrote: > I have discovered that in my next placement the staff wear scrubs, but > do not let the students do so. <snip> that would be like an Emergency department i worked in at one time in the good old bad old days of hats the department made a radical jump put the Nursing staff into scrubs and also decided to make medical staff wear a uniform the same scrubs but in green rather than blue ... these scrubs are different from those worn in theatres etc in the trust being the lojigma ones and not ordinary cotton ones... However HCAs and Students in the department wear conventional uniforms ... the HCAs because they decided that the HCAs shouldn't be wearing thesame uniforms as Staff nurses and they couldn't agree on a different scrub colour ( the male HCAs didn't want lilac and the female HCAs weren't to enamoured with grey or burgundy and blue, navy and green were alrady in use by RNs, CNs/NPs and doctors respectively)... if in the settign in question scrubs are worn for infection control reasons - students shoudl were them , if it is because that is the chosen uniform of thedepartment it makes little or no difference...

	#6
hindmost	Re: Uniform Curious wrote: > "Caol MacThòmais" wrote: >> I do like a good argument . And actually I think I have a good argument >> for students dressing the same as the permanent staff. > > I don't doubt that, but you are not playing on a level playing field. You > are at a disadvantage in the power gradient; this is a 'match' between a > GROUP of registered practitioners who as you say have permanent employee > status, and yourself, a transient, temporary, unregistered, not-employed > student. The dynamics don't seem to be in your favour! > >> that was a consideration, however from a brief meeting with some of the >> staff earlier in the week they seem a nice bunch, in many of these types >> of things I think there is a lot of 'it's always been done that way' >> thinking. > > I am sure they are very nice people, but they may not remain so if you rock > their boat too much > > Have fun! > > I've got some major worries with this which haven't been addressed in the previous posts. My experience of being in theatre areas is about 11 years out of date so please correct me if I am wrong. Static discharge can be a major problem in theatre. Pretty much everything entering a theatre had to be antistatic. (Scrubs are not made out of nylon for a reason) Where I work the student nurses uniforms are high on artificial fibres which worries me. My thoughts are there are basic health and safety and accountability issues involved here. Have the materials which the uniforms are made from been tested for their antistatic properties? Has a risk assessment been carried out regarding their use in these areas? I'd suggest that rather than pursue this argument yourself it'd be more productive to pass your concerns to one of the trade unions supporting student nurses. They will have access to far more resources than you have and enjying a good argument is no substitute for choosing the correct argument. It may not make them change the policy but you will have the comfort of knowing that if your uniform sparks your nearest and dearest will get a payout when you take out the entire theatre ;-@