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You should see the damage
Guzzi cam - doesn't seem too bad from peering down the pushrod tunnels: http://www.sweller.dynalias.org/guzzicam/ Opinions? Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. There is an external oil feed to the cylinder heads see this picture: http://www.sweller.dynalias.org/images/oil-feed.jpg The feed is the grey braided banjo hose. It comes from a single banjo and feeds the rocker lubrication to each head which then drains down the pushrod tunnels to the sump. I could mount a cooler more or less where the horn is in this picture: http://www.sweller.dynalias.org/images/guz_front.jpg If the single feed went to the cooler then running off a double banjo split to each head. Would the feed to head lines need to be equal length? Do oil coolers come with male or female fittings? What would be a likely donor bike to supply a cooler. Do they have thermostats or would it be cooling all the time? Opinions? -- Simon |
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Re: You should see the damage
sweller <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
> Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. Alternatively, you could try a sump extension. Allows the bike to carry more oil, and (obviously) extends the sump, therby improving both lube quality and cooling. I rode down to the Bol many years ago with a feller who had one on his Le Mans. They used to be easily obtainable and (of course) a doddle to fit. All you need are some longer allen bolts. Some come with external oil filter fitments too, which is a doubly good thing. So quite possibly easier and cheaper to source and fit than a cooler. -- K1100LT 955i 750SS CB400F CD250 CM200 SL125 GAGARPHOF#30 GHPOTHUF#1 BOTAFOT#60 The bells, the bells..... |
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Re: You should see the damage
The Older Gentleman wrote:
> > Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. > > Alternatively, you could try a sump extension. Allows the bike to carry > more oil, and (obviously) extends the sump, therby improving both lube > quality and cooling. Already has one - their primary purpose is less about cooling (although that is a side effect) but to increase the volume of air under the pistons which assists with breathing problems on higher performance Guzzi engines. -- Simon |
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Re: You should see the damage
On 3 Aug 2007 10:01:56 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote: >higher performance Guzzi engines. *snort* -- _______ ..'_/_|_\_'. Ace (brucedotrogers a.t rochedotcom) \`\ | /`/ DS#8 BOTAFOT#3 SbS#2 UKRMMA#13 DFV#8 SKA#2 IBB#10 `\\ | //' `\|/` ` |
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Re: You should see the damage
Ace wrote:
> > higher performance Guzzi engines. > > snort Well yes, but we are dealing with 30 year old bikes here. -- Simon |
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Re: You should see the damage
"sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message news:xn0f9ico910qxud001@news.individual.net... > > Guzzi cam - doesn't seem too bad from peering down the pushrod tunnels: > http://www.sweller.dynalias.org/guzzicam/ > > Opinions? > > > Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. There is > an external oil feed to the cylinder heads > > see this picture: http://www.sweller.dynalias.org/images/oil-feed.jpg > > The feed is the grey braided banjo hose. It comes from a single banjo and > feeds the rocker lubrication to each head which then drains down the > pushrod tunnels to the sump. > > I could mount a cooler more or less where the horn is in this picture: > http://www.sweller.dynalias.org/images/guz_front.jpg > > If the single feed went to the cooler then running off a double banjo > split to each head. > > Would the feed to head lines need to be equal length? > Do oil coolers come with male or female fittings? > What would be a likely donor bike to supply a cooler. > Do they have thermostats or would it be cooling all the time? > Don't connect the oil cooler to the head oil feed banjo on the crankcase at any cost. You'll have to get a special sump modification which allows correct take-off pipes to be attached. These were available on an exchange basis at one time from CorsaItaliana (Spares GB). JB |
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Re: You should see the damage
sweller wrote:
> The Older Gentleman wrote: > >>> Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. >> >> Alternatively, you could try a sump extension. Allows the bike to >> carry more oil, and (obviously) extends the sump, therby improving >> both lube quality and cooling. > > Already has one - their primary purpose is less about cooling > (although that is a side effect) but to increase the volume of air > under the pistons which assists with breathing problems on higher > performance Guzzi engines. Well as I already said OI PAY ATTENTION AT THE BACK oil cooling does not need a thermostat. I don't know about the routing questions you ask but I think all B12's have oil coolers, not as nice as mine of course, and the breaker should be full of them. You may need a friendy shop to make up pipes and connections. eBay "Bandit Oil Cooler" there are lots from £8 up to mine item 180145362798 -- Hog '03 ST4S '96 Bastard12 '89 R100RS '81 XS650 '78 RD400 |
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Re: You should see the damage
JB wrote:
> Don't connect the oil cooler to the head oil feed banjo on the > crankcase at any cost. You'll have to get a special sump modification > which allows correct take-off pipes to be attached. These were > available on an exchange basis at one time from CorsaItaliana (Spares > GB). JB You are introducing cost implications beyone Swellers tolerance you know -- Hog '03 ST4S '96 Bastard12 '89 R100RS '81 XS650 '78 RD400 |
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Re: You should see the damage
Hog wrote:
> Well as I already said OI PAY ATTENTION AT THE BACK oil cooling does > not need a thermostat. I know - I read it after I posted. Although, a water cooling system doesn't need a thermostat it's desirable it's not cooling when it doesn't need to. The same should apply to an oil cooler especially when it's the primary cooling system (as it is on a Bandit). -- Simon |
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Re: You should see the damage
JB wrote:
> > Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. There > > is an external oil feed to the cylinder heads > Don't connect the oil cooler to the head oil feed banjo on the > crankcase at any cost It seemed a good idea at the time... Thinking about it there may be oil starvation problems as it's on the wrong side of the feed. > You'll have to get a special sump modification > which allows correct take-off pipes to be attached. These were > available on an exchange basis at one time from CorsaItaliana (Spares > GB). JB Who are not answering the phone at the moment but I'm not expecting plenty cheapness. -- Simon |
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Re: You should see the damage
sweller wrote:
> Hog wrote: > >> Well as I already said OI PAY ATTENTION AT THE BACK oil cooling does >> not need a thermostat. > > I know - I read it after I posted. > > Although, a water cooling system doesn't need a thermostat it's > desirable it's not cooling when it doesn't need to. The same should > apply to an oil cooler especially when it's the primary cooling > system (as it is on a Bandit). Yess but the whole shabang works so differently and oil has rather different thermodynamic qualities if you are using something like a 5w50 Mobil IYSWIM. R100RS's have coolers and no thermostats either IIRC -- Hog '03 ST4S '96 Bastard12 '89 R100RS '81 XS650 '78 RD400 |
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Re: You should see the damage
"sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message news:xn0f9idzc12hxq5005@news.individual.net... > JB wrote: > >> > Hog passed comment on an oil cooler - this may be a good idea. There >> > is an external oil feed to the cylinder heads > >> Don't connect the oil cooler to the head oil feed banjo on the >> crankcase at any cost > > It seemed a good idea at the time... Thinking about it there may be oil > starvation problems as it's on the wrong side of the feed. > > >> You'll have to get a special sump modification >> which allows correct take-off pipes to be attached. These were >> available on an exchange basis at one time from CorsaItaliana (Spares >> GB). JB > > Who are not answering the phone at the moment but I'm not expecting > plenty cheapness. > Have a look if you go to the International Guzzi Owners club's V-Twin Rally over Aug bank holiday weekend in Ringwood. The biggest Guzzi autojumble you've ever seen. I've bought two such sumps there over the years (and far, far too many other 'bargain-must-have-or-I-will-surely-die-without' spares). This possibly explains the state of my garage. The other option is to find a friendly machinist and bore/tap your own sump for oil take-off pipe fittings. JB |
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Re: You should see the damage
JB wrote:
> The other option is to find a friendly machinist and bore/tap your own > sump for oil take-off pipe fittings. That I can do. Do you have a picture or drawings of a modified one? -- Simon |
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Re: You should see the damage
"sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message news:xn0f9ih7e16vp6v000@news.individual.net... > JB wrote: > >> The other option is to find a friendly machinist and bore/tap your own >> sump for oil take-off pipe fittings. > > That I can do. Do you have a picture or drawings of a modified one? > Don't I just wish. The 2 I bought went straight ot thier new owners (I'd been asked to buy them if I spotted any). I didn't have chance to examine & dimension them up. I wasn't too complicated though from memory. The photos in the Guzzi manual should suffice to work out the oilways to tap into. Outlet to cooler should be before the filter (possibly have to put a threaded plug into this gallery just before the filter) and the return from the cooler back into the gallery the filter is screwed into. 5/8" bore braided lines should do the job I reckon. I've got to do this very job soon myself for the trike. I've got a cooler and lines/unions but haven't got a spare sump unfortunately, and I'm not taking the trike off the road while I do the machining. JB |
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Re: You should see the damage
"Hog" <hogSPAM@freenetCHIPS.co.uk> wrote in
news:f8v0n4$255$1@registered.motzarella.org: > sweller wrote: >> Hog wrote: >> >>> Well as I already said OI PAY ATTENTION AT THE BACK oil cooling does >>> not need a thermostat. >> >> I know - I read it after I posted. >> >> Although, a water cooling system doesn't need a thermostat it's >> desirable it's not cooling when it doesn't need to. The same should >> apply to an oil cooler especially when it's the primary cooling >> system (as it is on a Bandit). > > Yess but the whole shabang works so differently and oil has rather > different thermodynamic qualities if you are using something like a > 5w50 Mobil IYSWIM. > > R100RS's have coolers and no thermostats either IIRC > later boxers have thermostats, don't they? IIRC it is one of the differences between the 1100cc and 1150cc R-GS variants. -- wessie at tesco dot net BMW R1150GS "Wessie is a lovely man with many wonderful qualities" TM Blaney |
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Re: You should see the damage
wessie wrote:
> "Hog" <hogSPAM@freenetCHIPS.co.uk> wrote in > news:f8v0n4$255$1@registered.motzarella.org: > >> sweller wrote: >>> Hog wrote: >>> >>>> Well as I already said OI PAY ATTENTION AT THE BACK oil cooling >>>> does not need a thermostat. >>> >>> I know - I read it after I posted. >>> >>> Although, a water cooling system doesn't need a thermostat it's >>> desirable it's not cooling when it doesn't need to. The same should >>> apply to an oil cooler especially when it's the primary cooling >>> system (as it is on a Bandit). >> >> Yess but the whole shabang works so differently and oil has rather >> different thermodynamic qualities if you are using something like a >> 5w50 Mobil IYSWIM. >> >> R100RS's have coolers and no thermostats either IIRC >> > > later boxers have thermostats, don't they? > > IIRC it is one of the differences between the 1100cc and 1150cc R-GS > variants. No idea never worked on a Beemer made after they abandoned quality control ;o) -- Hog '03 ST4S '96 Bastard12 '89 R100RS '81 XS650 '78 RD400 |
