Smoke An Mirrors

HOWEDY lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn,

javagsd@yahoo.com wrote:
> You're right - it's always handler timing. It would
> be more appropriate to say that far too often the handler
> distracts from the goal by c/t.

Well, PERHAPS THAT'D be on accHOWENT of you
didn't FADE the TREAT, lying "I LOVE KOEHLER"
lynn.

Seems your DIMINISHING REWARDS would come in handy here abHOWETS.

> A good example would be working on eye contact throughout
> a recall and clicking mid distance -

HOWE COME would you CLICK the dog if IT is already responding?

> the c/t distracts from the goal in that example.

You mean, it'd make the dog PAY ATTENTION to
his handler, while coming on command, lying
"I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn?

HOWE would THAT be CONtraWIZE to the command?

Oh, HERE'S HOWE COME:

From: java...@yahoo.com
Date: 21 Jun 2005 10:13:14 -0700

Subject: Re: Collars

It's all done with mirrors. What's a Wizard without
his mirror? Wait! Do you suppose he's confused his
monitor screen for a mirror?

Lynn K.

From: java...@yahoo.com
Date: 21 Jun 2005 09:23:14 -0700

Subject: Re: Collars

Jack, you would have loved a seminar I was at recently where
the limitations of clicker training were discussed. Lori
Drouin is a great trainer, uses food, clickers, positive
reinforcement primarily - but she is also a realist.

We were working on extended uses of tools and she pointed out
the obvious about the click/treat being useless for chained
sequences because it directs the dog back to the handler in
the middle of the sequence.

But she also pointed out something so simply obvious that rang
a bell with me - in any behavior where the goal is handler
attention, the clicker redirects attention to the treat rather
than the handler. Bingo.

Lynn K.

From: java...@yahoo.com
Date: 21 Jun 2005 22:01:47 -0700
Subject: Re: Collars

Robin wrote:

> Actually clicker training can be extremely effective
> for chained sequences, however, the best way to use
> it in such sequences is through backchaining.

----

Ya know, I kind of mangled the point she was trying to make -
that people mistime the c/t because they forget that it
causes a recall to handler.

They start to use it to encourage or mean Keep Going -
totally in conflict with how the dog responds to it.

From: java...@yahoo.com
Date: 21 Jun 2005 12:56:29 -0700
Subject: Re: Collars

CC (rewards & praise) works just fine with fear aggressive
dogs. It's a reinforcer, not a conditioner, with a dominant
aggressive dog.

And of course CC techniques involve praise.

I didn't mention it because I thought I was talking
to folks who knew WTF they were talking about.

Lynn K.

From: java...@yahoo.com
Date: 21 Jun 2005 12:52:37 -0700

Subject: Re: Collars

Why, yes, he is the crazy one. Glad you finally noticed.

"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution
Will Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER"
lynn.

lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to it.
When he barks, use the line for a correction.

if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar.

Lynn K.

Here's lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn's PARTNER:

"Many People Have Problems Getting The Pinch
Right, Either They Do Not Pinch Enough, Or They
Have A Very Stoic Dog. Some Dogs Will Collapse
Into A Heap. About The Ear Pinch: You Must Keep
The Pressure Up," sindy "don't let the dog SCREAM"
mooreon, author of HOWER FAQ's pages on k9 web.

You think HURTING a HUNTING DOG
to MAKE IT HUNT is NECESSARY???

"I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in
one shelter.) But their ability to set their own
schedules and duties causes a great deal of
scheduling overhead.

And it takes effort and thought to ensure that
volunteers get the meaningful experience that
they work for.

Someone has to be responsible for that
Volunteer Program, and it is best done
by a non-volunteer."

Lynn K.

------------------------------*---

"I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed
every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the
effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the
older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition.

Should I have refused to groom them?

Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who
had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter."

Lynn K.

Baghdad Bob <Baghdadbob> wrote in message
<news:04591a2c5d469ef78d35c89ed4ed58f7@TeraNews>.. .

> >> Lynn, looks like he got you there if these
> >> quotes are true.

> >> In the posts below you take responsibility for
> >> making those calls.

> >> In your post above, you state you do not
> >> make those calls.

> >>Which one is it?

------------------------------*------------

THAT'S INSANE, AIN'T IT... LIKE THIS:

"You Lying Sack Of Dung.When Have I Ever Said
Anything About Using A Prong Collar, Or Any Collar
Correction At All, To Make Dogs Friendly To House
Cats? Don't bother. The answer is never," lying "I
LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.

lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn writes about kats and dogs:

"This Article Is Something We've Put Together
For SF GSD Rescue

From: Lynn Kosmakos (lkosma...@home.com)
Subject: Re: I have a dog he has cats
Date: 1999/11/20

ginge...@my-deja.com wrote:
> How can I get him to quit chasing the cats.

Okay - this is going to be a bit loooong - Lynn K.

"Put a prong collar with a six-foot leash on the dog. Don't
forget to put the muzzle on the dog. I think a prong works
better than a choke with less chance of injury to the dog in
this situation.

Electronics can be used to create an aversion to cats, but
should be used under the direction of a trainer who knows how
to instruct the owner in their proper use. Electronics can
take the form of shock, sonic or citronella collars. At that
time the owner will train with electronics instead of food or
whatever other reward system was being used."

8) Put a prong collar with a six-foot leash on the dog.
Don't forget to put the muzzle on the dog. I think a prong
works better than a choke with less chance of injury to the
dog in this situation. Have the dog in a sit-stay next to
you with most of the slack out of the leash and let the cat
walk through the room and up to the dog if it wishes (this is
why you have the dog muzzled).

If the dog makes an aggressive move towards the
cat, it must be corrected strongly with both your
voice and the collar.

This is important - the correction must be physically
very strong - not a nag. (PS: not many dogs need
to be corrected at all)."

"J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@mb-m18.aol.com...

> He was next to me and I could see his neck
> muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.

> Janet Boss
"sionnach" <rhyfe...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@ID-45033.news.uni-berlin.de...

> "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@mb-m17.aol.com...

> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher
> > > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
> > > dog like a Lab.

An INSENSITIVE DOG???

THAT'S INSANE, AIN'T IT.

HERE'S HOWE COME:

WORDS OF WISDOM
from our own Lynn Kosmakos
1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every day
For Twenty Years

I THINK I'M QUALIFIED TO TALK ABOUT LITHIUM

"I, too, have a bi-polar mood disorder (manic-depression)
requiring 1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every
day.

I, also, care about dogs and use this forum to learn
more, while happily sharing pertinent information
I have learned. But if I were ever to post such sh*t,
I would hope that every other reader of this group
would be rightfully outraged."

"Community is an evolutionary thing that we earn
the right to participate in by observing the
easily understood rules and contributing to in
constructive ways."

Lynn K.

---------------------------

SEE? SEE? SEE?

	#1
WardManager@Animail.Net	Smoke An Mirrors HOWEDY lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn, javagsd@yahoo.com wrote: > You're right - it's always handler timing. It would > be more appropriate to say that far too often the handler > distracts from the goal by c/t. Well, PERHAPS THAT'D be on accHOWENT of you didn't FADE the TREAT, lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn. Seems your DIMINISHING REWARDS would come in handy here abHOWETS. > A good example would be working on eye contact throughout > a recall and clicking mid distance - HOWE COME would you CLICK the dog if IT is already responding? > the c/t distracts from the goal in that example. You mean, it'd make the dog PAY ATTENTION to his handler, while coming on command, lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn? HOWE would THAT be CONtraWIZE to the command? Oh, HERE'S HOWE COME: From: java...@yahoo.com Date: 21 Jun 2005 10:13:14 -0700 Subject: Re: Collars It's all done with mirrors. What's a Wizard without his mirror? Wait! Do you suppose he's confused his monitor screen for a mirror? Lynn K. From: java...@yahoo.com Date: 21 Jun 2005 09:23:14 -0700 Subject: Re: Collars Jack, you would have loved a seminar I was at recently where the limitations of clicker training were discussed. Lori Drouin is a great trainer, uses food, clickers, positive reinforcement primarily - but she is also a realist. We were working on extended uses of tools and she pointed out the obvious about the click/treat being useless for chained sequences because it directs the dog back to the handler in the middle of the sequence. But she also pointed out something so simply obvious that rang a bell with me - in any behavior where the goal is handler attention, the clicker redirects attention to the treat rather than the handler. Bingo. Lynn K. From: java...@yahoo.com Date: 21 Jun 2005 22:01:47 -0700 Subject: Re: Collars Robin wrote: > Actually clicker training can be extremely effective > for chained sequences, however, the best way to use > it in such sequences is through backchaining. ---- Ya know, I kind of mangled the point she was trying to make - that people mistime the c/t because they forget that it causes a recall to handler. They start to use it to encourage or mean Keep Going - totally in conflict with how the dog responds to it. From: java...@yahoo.com Date: 21 Jun 2005 12:56:29 -0700 Subject: Re: Collars CC (rewards & praise) works just fine with fear aggressive dogs. It's a reinforcer, not a conditioner, with a dominant aggressive dog. And of course CC techniques involve praise. I didn't mention it because I thought I was talking to folks who knew WTF they were talking about. Lynn K. From: java...@yahoo.com Date: 21 Jun 2005 12:52:37 -0700 Subject: Re: Collars Why, yes, he is the crazy one. Glad you finally noticed. "Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution Will Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn. lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver: For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to it. When he barks, use the line for a correction. if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar. Lynn K. Here's lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn's PARTNER: "Many People Have Problems Getting The Pinch Right, Either They Do Not Pinch Enough, Or They Have A Very Stoic Dog. Some Dogs Will Collapse Into A Heap. About The Ear Pinch: You Must Keep The Pressure Up," sindy "don't let the dog SCREAM" mooreon, author of HOWER FAQ's pages on k9 web. You think HURTING a HUNTING DOG to MAKE IT HUNT is NECESSARY??? "I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in one shelter.) But their ability to set their own schedules and duties causes a great deal of scheduling overhead. And it takes effort and thought to ensure that volunteers get the meaningful experience that they work for. Someone has to be responsible for that Volunteer Program, and it is best done by a non-volunteer." Lynn K. --------------------------------- "I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition. Should I have refused to groom them? Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter." Lynn K. Baghdad Bob <Baghdadbob> wrote in message <news:04591a2c5d469ef78d35c89ed4ed58f7@TeraNews>.. . > >> Lynn, looks like he got you there if these > >> quotes are true. > >> In the posts below you take responsibility for > >> making those calls. > >> In your post above, you state you do not > >> make those calls. > >>Which one is it? ------------------------------------------ THAT'S INSANE, AIN'T IT... LIKE THIS: "You Lying Sack Of Dung.When Have I Ever Said Anything About Using A Prong Collar, Or Any Collar Correction At All, To Make Dogs Friendly To House Cats? Don't bother. The answer is never," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn. lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn writes about kats and dogs: "This Article Is Something We've Put Together For SF GSD Rescue From: Lynn Kosmakos (lkosma...@home.com) Subject: Re: I have a dog he has cats Date: 1999/11/20 ginge...@my-deja.com wrote: > How can I get him to quit chasing the cats. Okay - this is going to be a bit loooong - Lynn K. "Put a prong collar with a six-foot leash on the dog. Don't forget to put the muzzle on the dog. I think a prong works better than a choke with less chance of injury to the dog in this situation. Electronics can be used to create an aversion to cats, but should be used under the direction of a trainer who knows how to instruct the owner in their proper use. Electronics can take the form of shock, sonic or citronella collars. At that time the owner will train with electronics instead of food or whatever other reward system was being used." 8) Put a prong collar with a six-foot leash on the dog. Don't forget to put the muzzle on the dog. I think a prong works better than a choke with less chance of injury to the dog in this situation. Have the dog in a sit-stay next to you with most of the slack out of the leash and let the cat walk through the room and up to the dog if it wishes (this is why you have the dog muzzled). If the dog makes an aggressive move towards the cat, it must be corrected strongly with both your voice and the collar. This is important - the correction must be physically very strong - not a nag. (PS: not many dogs need to be corrected at all)." "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@mb-m18.aol.com... > He was next to me and I could see his neck > muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye. > Janet Boss "sionnach" <rhyfe...@msn.com> wrote in message news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@ID-45033.news.uni-berlin.de... > "J1Boss" <j1b...@aol.com> wrote in message > news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@mb-m17.aol.com... > > > I can't imagine needing anything higher > > > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive > > > dog like a Lab. An INSENSITIVE DOG??? THAT'S INSANE, AIN'T IT. HERE'S HOWE COME: WORDS OF WISDOM from our own Lynn Kosmakos 1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every day For Twenty Years I THINK I'M QUALIFIED TO TALK ABOUT LITHIUM "I, too, have a bi-polar mood disorder (manic-depression) requiring 1200mg of lithium and 50 mg of Zoloft every day. I, also, care about dogs and use this forum to learn more, while happily sharing pertinent information I have learned. But if I were ever to post such sh*t, I would hope that every other reader of this group would be rightfully outraged." "Community is an evolutionary thing that we earn the right to participate in by observing the easily understood rules and contributing to in constructive ways." Lynn K. --------------------------- SEE? SEE? SEE?